Miscarriage Part 2 — with Stephanie Green
Lingering grief and fear can take hold in the life of those who have experienced miscarriage. Like all difficult and unwanted experiences, the key to moving on after pregnancy loss is the hope we find in Christ.
Stephanie Green returns for part two of her interview about miscarriage. She discusses the hope that families can find in the character of God, and how Christians can be good stewards of life’s painful and unpleasant challenges.
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Joyful Journey Podcast is a ministry of Faith Bible Seminary. All proceeds go to offset costs of this podcast and toward scholarships for women to receive their MABC through Faith Bible Seminary.
Resources
Resources
Books
Dark Clouds, Deep Mercy - Mark Vroegop
Miscarriage: You Are Not Alone - Stephanie Green
Podcasts
Miscarriage Part 1 - Joyful Journey
Biblical Lament - Joyful Journey
Helping the Grieving - Joyful Journey Podcast
Websites
Transcript:
Jocelyn: I don't just need to feel better. I need the truth. And ultimately that will make me better.
Janet: I just want to make it as totally simple as possible for ladies to see that the Bible is really applicable to their everyday life.
Jocelyn: When they understand theology, the application flows out of it quickly with joy.
Janet: It is a journey, but even the journey itself is joyful when I'm doing it, holding the hand of my savior and trusting him all along the way. This is the joyful journey podcast, a podcast to inspire and equip women to passionately pursue beautiful biblical truth on their journey as women of God. When you choose truth, you're choosing joy.
Janet: Hi listeners, welcome back. I'm here as always with Jocelyn Wallace.
Jocelyn: Hey friends.
Janet: And again with our friend, Stephanie.
Stephanie: Hello.
Janet: Who was with us in our last episode as we began talking about An important topic with miscarriage, but there was more. So we've asked Stephanie to come back and share a little more with us, and especially this time focusing on some of the specific fears. And even more than that, what are some passages of scripture that give hope? And how can we face this potential or this reality with a quiet soul and with hope.
Stephanie: Thank you so much for having me again to continue our discussion on miscarriage. During the first episode, we discussed common misconceptions associated with miscarriage, the unique challenges of having a miscarriage, reminders from God's word of his presence, faithfulness, and care. And finally, we considered how family and friends can minister to those who lost a child. If you've not listened to the first episode, I wanna encourage you right now to go do that first, because we covered a lot of ground in that first episode.
Janet: Yes, we did.
Stephanie: However, we did not have time to discuss other important issues associated with miscarriage. Therefore, we believed it was important to return to the subject today. So our task today is gonna consider how we can have hope from the Lord to move forward. I wanna start by just sharing a tweet from John Piper. His tweet said, grieve your losses, dry your tears, and embrace the life God has given you. Now, we may not be ready to do that immediately, especially after a miscarriage, but at some point we need to accept its truth. We must embrace the life we have. And embracing is about accepting the life God has given us. It's about owning it, stewarding it to the best of our ability, not just resigning to the inevitable. Meaning you're just going to go with it. It happened and there's nothing I can do about it. This tends to lead to fear. Fear of what's coming next. And I find that grief is not what holds us back. We all grieve. The obstacle to moving forward is fear. So today I wanna address fear from a couple of perspectives.
Jocelyn: This will be good. I was thinking how difficult it would be to want to get pregnant again after having a miscarriage. I had a rough first pregnancy, and my second pregnancy was rough for a whole bunch of different reasons, mostly because I was afraid the entire time of what was gonna happen.
Stephanie: Yep. That is so common, the fear that you're not going to be able to get pregnant again. That's the first fear we're gonna talk about.
Jocelyn: Oh yeah.
Stephanie: This is very common, a common concern that affects many women after miscarriage, and it's especially acute if you took extraordinary measures to become pregnant. If one is not careful, it can quickly dominate your thinking after each month that passes without a pregnancy. As a result, getting pregnant and having another baby becomes the center of your life. Every day of the month revolves around that sweet little calendar and what day of your cycle it is. It's easy to be consumed by the desire to have another baby and the fear that you won't be able to. And you know, I was caught up in this. Every day of the month, it was like, oh, my thoughts, my desires were all centered around the calendar.
Janet: Yeah.
Jocelyn: That would be such an enslaving way to live.
Stephanie: It is.
Jocelyn: To think about nothing more than a thing that you might never have.
Stephanie: Yeah. It's miserable. And you know, when you allow your desire for a baby to dominate your life or anything for that matter, then you've let a good and God-given desire take God's place in your life. And that's not what he designed life to be like. So let's look how we can address this fear from God's word. First, we need to take every thought captive. Philippians 4:8 calls you to think on things that are true, honorable, right, pure, lovely, and of good repute or character. Notice that it doesn't say to think on the what ifs. Yet, how many times do you find your thoughts focused there? It's easy to do, especially when you long to have a baby. How do you put aside fear and focus on truth? I'm gonna suggest that we need to begin by evaluating our own heart. Is there an idol that I'm allowing to control my life? Is there a lie I'm choosing to believe? If so, I need to repent to the Lord and turn my focus to Jesus, the one who is perfectly true, perfectly honorable, right, pure, lovely, and of good character. He is the only one who knows the future and will provide for us and walk with us through whatever it holds.
Janet: You know, I've had people tell me before that they think about the what ifs because in their mind, that's preparing themselves spiritually. What if I can never have a child? How will I deal with that?
Jocelyn: Well, God has -
Janet: What if I have another miscarriage? How will I deal with that? And that's, I think we can deceive ourselves into thinking
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: This is spiritual preparation.
Jocelyn: Yep. When really I've learned the what if, if anything starts with what if, it's usually worrying.
Janet: Yeah.
Jocelyn: Like it's usually, I'm planning ahead that it won't happen. So I need to prep for not getting it.
Janet: Yeah. Yeah. And so I tell people the best way that you can prepare for anything that might be a what if, is to be trusting Jesus and living his way today.
Stephanie: Yes.
Janet: That's how you prepare for that.
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: You don't prepare by imagining things that haven't happened and then imagining yourself handling it.
Stephanie: Yep.
Janet: Or not. You prepare by living wisely today, which is what you're saying. Taking my thoughts captive.
Stephanie: Yep.
Janet: That is preparation for whatever the Lord is gonna allow us.
Stephanie: Absolutely. We need to remember that what occupies your mind is an indication of what you value.
Janet: Oh, I love that. I mean, think about that. Cuz you've already mentioned idolatry and some of our listeners are going, I don't know if I really struggle with that, but what's occupying my mind? I mean, let's just think about that.
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: What might be occupying the mind of someone. And I say that as if, I don't know. I lost
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: four myself. So what might be occupying the mind? For me, one of them was, I don't think I could handle that again. So fearing what if I had another one. And then I did. And what if I had another one? And then I did. But I had the grace when I needed it. I didn't have it up front. When I was
Jocelyn: When you were thinking about it.
Janet: fearing about. So that's one of them for me. I don't know. You guys can think of any others?
Jocelyn: I think that some women who are thinking in idolatrous way would be thinking, I have to have another baby.
Janet: Yes.
Jocelyn: I'm afraid of only having a single child or no children. Like this is not what I designed our family like inside of my head. So I think of like, The must statements. We have to have a baby. Like we can't go through life as a family without children. And so the idolatry would be the things that I'm feeling that I must have in order for my life to have either the meaning that I thought it would or the context that I thought I was gonna be having.
Stephanie: Yeah, good.
Janet: Yeah. Yeah. And I think fearing the future, if in my mind it's like, oh my word then when we're old, there'll be nobody to take care of us. You know? I'm not taking my thoughts captive. None of those things are happening right now. But I've already determined if we don't have children, what's that gonna mean when we're older, who's gonna take care of me? And then how am I gonna survive? So when I don't take my thoughts captive, it's amazing the places it'll go.
Stephanie: Absolutely. So my question would be, for those who are listening, what is it that you value most at this time? Are you forgetting God in the midst of your heartache? Psalm 94:19 says, when my anxious thoughts multiply within me, your comfort delights my soul. There are many things we tend to turn to when we are troubled, and it could be anything. It could be going shopping, it could be
Janet: Yeah.
Stephanie: Overeating. It could be running to the store and buying a bunch of alcohol. Because if I don't have to think about it, I don't have to deal with it. There are many things that we turn to when we are troubled, but only God is able to provide lasting comfort when we turn to him. So friends, run to him. Matthew 6:25 through 34 reminds us that God cares for more than the birds. He clothes the fields in greater splendor than Solomon. We invest in his kingdom and his righteousness and allow the peace that comes from God to rule our hearts and minds.
Janet: Isn't that what we're all looking for? Is that peace?
Stephanie: Yes. The other thing that we need to think about when we start fearing that we're not gonna be able to get pregnant again, is that we need to remember God is the one who opens and closes the womb. There's several places in scripture that address infertility and loss, and as I read those passages, I'm thankful for the reminder that it is God who opens and closes the womb. This sweet reminder in scripture is so freeing. I don't know about you guys, but it was a challenge for me to get pregnant. I remember at times feeling as if my emotions were on a rollercoaster. And you know when you start tackling the calendar, okay, well, We're only fertile for these few days.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: So you have to keep track of what day you're on. And it seems like with idolatry you start centering everything around those days on the calendar, the times you have intimacy with your husband. The times,
Janet: which is so romantic, isn't it?
Jocelyn: I was just like,
Janet: it has to be right now. I've been there. We totally went through all of this.
Jocelyn: Really sets the stage for some loving moments.
Stephanie: Oh yes. But that is idolatry.
Janet: Yep.
Stephanie: You are so focused on having this child that you so desire, that everything becomes regimented. I remember early on we received all sorts of advice on how to get pregnant.
Janet: Oh, yeah.
Stephanie: And I mean, I could list some bizarre things that we were told, but you know what? The thing is, is that you start thinking that, well, maybe that will work. As if it's all up to us.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: And it almost felt as if we had this huge weight on our shoulders as we tried to conceive, like I said, like it was all up to us.
Jocelyn: It's such a feeling of needing to control the situation it seems like.
Stephanie: Yes. Yep. And I think that that idolatry, if you're not careful, it can cause a lot of conflict in your marriages.
Janet: Absolutely.
Jocelyn: Truly, yeah.
Stephanie: But you know what? As I read these passages in God's word, they don't point to us at all. Instead, they point to God, and they remind us that he is the one who is in control. He is the one who opens and closes the womb. And sometimes after experiencing loss, we fail to go to the Lord. But you know, one of my favorite ladies in scripture the story's encouraging because that wasn't the case with her. Many of you are probably familiar with the story of Hannah, in First Samuel one. For many years, the Lord had closed her womb. However, that was not the case with her husband's wife, Peninnah. She had many sons and daughters, and the text says Peninnah would provoke Hannah bitterly to irritate her because the Lord had closed her womb. In Hannah's loss, she went to the Lord. In fact, she went to the Lord so hard that Eli thought she was drunk. Her response to Eli was, I am a woman oppressed in spirit. I have drunk neither wine nor strong drink, but I have poured out my soul before the Lord. I don't know about you guys, but in those early days of trying to get pregnant, I don't know that I poured out my soul to the Lord like Hannah did. So what an encouragement.
Janet: Yeah. I think what I did, I prayed, but I prayed that God would bless my plans.
Stephanie: Yes, yes.
Janet: So I did pray.
Stephanie: I did too. I prayed.
Janet: But it wasn't pouring out my soul.
Jocelyn: Not pouring out your soul.
Janet: No.
Stephanie: It was not pouring out my soul either. So like Hannah, I want to encourage you to run to the Lord and pour out your soul to him. That's what he wants. He wants us to go to him. Don't get caught in the thought that this is all on your shoulders.
Janet: Right.
Stephanie: Because it's not. It's God who opens and closes the womb. And I love being able to share those passages with ladies that I'm working with, because it's an encouragement. And it's a weight off of their shoulders.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: That wow. I can just sit back and enjoy my husband.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: No matter what day of the calendar it is, because it's not in my control. It's totally in God's. And that's encouraging.
Janet: Yes.
Jocelyn: For someone who may want to learn how to pour your heart out to the Lord. You could go back and listen to our lament episode that released
Stephanie: Yes.
Jocelyn: In March of 23. I'm thinking of that episode while you're talking, and how helpful that concept would've been
Janet: Yes.
Jocelyn: When you were in the middle of that pain, to say like a prayer in pain turns your heart toward the Lord.
Stephanie: Yes.
Jocelyn: And asks him to move in the middle of that situation. And it's raw and honest and real. It's not cleaned up. It's honest.
Stephanie: Yep. And if you haven't read that book,
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Stephanie: Dark Clouds, Deep Mercy. Great, great book to read.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: In the midst of all of this. So let's talk about a second fear. Second fear that I'd like to address today is the fear of having another miscarriage. The pregnancy after my miscarriage. I really, really struggled with this. In one sense, I was so excited cuz we had tried so long to get pregnant. But on the other hand, I was afraid to get too excited about the pregnancy. I didn't want to get too attached to this baby. Because I was fearing what if those what ifs again?
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Stephanie: What if something happens? And I found myself really fearful of what was going to happen every time I went to the bathroom. That's idolatry.
Jocelyn: That's a lot of times a day.
Stephanie: Yes it is. And you're afraid, oh my goodness. If I
Janet: what if I see?
Stephanie: What if I bathroom and wipe and I see blood? What's gonna happen? Can anybody relate to that?
Janet: Yeah.
Jocelyn: Absolutely.
Stephanie: I'm sure they can. My fear of losing this baby was subtly consuming me and robbing me of my joy. It was the thing that was occupying my thinking throughout the entire day. I remember my husband talking with me and lovingly reminding me of truth, and he reminded me that God was the one that was in control. And that I could trust him. He reminded me that the baby I was carrying was God's. And encouraged me to enjoy every moment the Lord entrusted him to our care. You see, I was not filtering my thoughts through Philippians 4:8, but instead I was allowing my feelings to direct my life rather than the truth of God's word.
Jocelyn: I think the hard thing about trusting God is that it's so moment by moment. And you trust him in one moment, and then you get to the next moment and you're like, The only way to trust God is to literally trust God.
Stephanie: Yep.
Jocelyn: In that second.
Janet: Right.
Jocelyn: And it can go on all day or all week, or all month or nine months. But the trusting God is such an easy little answer That is so difficult to do in real time.
Stephanie: It is.
Janet: Well, I think especially after something has happened. Because when you've never had a miscarriage, you're trusting God that you'll have a healthy baby.
Jocelyn: it's very blithe, you know?
Janet: And you don't,
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: You don't obsess over it.
Stephanie: Yep.
Janet: Now, I know for me, when you've had a miscarriage and then you're pregnant, here's what you know, trusting God does not equal a baby.
Jocelyn: Right.
Janet: So trusting God, I can't say I trust he'll let me have this one.
Jocelyn: Right.
Janet: I can't say that. I can say I trust his heart. Which really is a refining moment. when I say trust God, a lot of times what I mean is I think I'm gonna get what I want.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Jocelyn: Right.
Janet: Instead of, I love that Rob said that to you because Brent had to say the very same thing to me. It was with my Fourth pregnancy. Cause I lost the first three. And then with my fourth pregnancy, he looked at me and said, are you ever gonna be excited? And I said, I seriously don't know how to feel, because I know being pregnant doesn't equal having a baby.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: I don't even know what I'm supposed to feel right now.
Jocelyn: Right.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Janet: And he said to me, we will rejoice every day the Lord allows us to have life. We already have the life.
Jocelyn: Yep.
Janet: It's just not outside of me yet. So we're gonna praise the Lord for that. We're not praising the Lord for the guarantee of the future. We're praising the Lord for today.
Stephanie: Yes.
Janet: And that was really reorienting for me.
Stephanie: Yeah. It was me too.
Jocelyn: What a helpful tool.
Stephanie: Oh yeah. And I was thankful that my husband was willing to do that.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: To just tell me that. Because up to that point it was like, I don't know why I thought fear and worry was going to keep that baby in there cuz it wasn't.
Janet: Right.
Stephanie: So it was a switch though for me because he said that and it was like, oh duh. You're right. So I remember just experiencing the rest of that pregnancy with great joy.
Janet: Yes.
Jocelyn: Oh, that’s cool.
Stephanie: And excitement.
Jocelyn: I'm so thankful for our husbands.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Jocelyn: It's like they can see what needs to be said.
Stephanie: Yep.
Jocelyn: And they're able to say it in a way that we can hear.
Stephanie: Yep.
Janet: Yeah.
Stephanie: Absolutely. One of the things I love about God's word too is how practical it is. I often think how kind it was of the Lord to include certain passages in his word, and one of those passages is found just prior to verse eight. In Philippians four, we read in verses six and seven. Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving, let your request be made known to God, and the peace of God which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus. You know, fearfulness and anxiety are often the result of feeling alone. So how is it that you can accomplish not being anxious about anything? I mean, that just-- that verse seems like a daunting task at times. But look at verse five. It says The Lord is near. What a precious promise. The one who is in complete control of your life, the one who cares about every detail of your life. He's near. So there's no need to be anxious. Instead, he wants you to run to him. He wants you to talk to him. And when you do, he will give you peace. Peace that will guard your heart and your mind.
Janet: That's beautiful.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Jocelyn: And I think that also helps you to measure idolatry. So what is the treasure of your life? Is it him?
Stephanie: Yes.
Jocelyn: Or is it getting the thing that you so desperately want?
Stephanie: Yep. Absolutely.
Janet: And you know what I love is in that moment, Instead of being overwhelmed with guilt, when I realize it's not him. I get to run to him and tell him that.
Jocelyn: Yes, yes.
Janet: Like I just run to him and go, I don't,
Jocelyn: he's the solution.
Janet: Help me.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Janet: Because I can't, I don't know how to change this.
Stephanie: Yep.
Janet: And he says, come to me.
Stephanie: Yep. So when you find your mind wandering down the path of what ifs, remember that you can entrust yourself and your future to the God who cares for you.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: You can cast all your anxiety on him. Why? 1 Peter 5:7 says, because he cares for you. I recently read a quote by Paul Tripp, which said, you don't have to be anxious about the future because what's coming is in the hands of the one who is wise, powerful, faithful, and good. Isn't that the truth?
Janet: Yeah.
Stephanie: When you remember who is in control of your future and what he's already done for you, you can have peace as you trust.
Jocelyn: And especially if the plan he has for you is not necessarily the plan that you had for you.
Stephanie: Yes.
Jocelyn: It's good to know that we can trust a God whose plan is better.
Stephanie: Absolutely.
Jocelyn: We think we have great plans, but one of the things that is hard in reality is his plan is not our plan, but his plan is better. It's the best.
Janet: Yeah, we're not settling for less. It's because he's bigger.
Jocelyn: No. It's better.
Janet: Yeah.
Jocelyn: It's better than the plan we thought was good for us.
Stephanie: Yeah. So, you know, one of my favorite books right now in the whole topic of miscarriage is Abby Wedgworths book called Held.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: And I love the way she said something, she said, as we walk forward into the future that is unknown to us, we can embrace with certainty the comfort that comes from the knowledge of who God is, the fact that he is with us and the assurance that he is leading us by His grace toward a new heaven and a new earth where there will be no more sorrow, no more pain and no more babies that die too young.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: Regardless of whether or not she is ever able to carry any future babies to term, this is the sure fixed and certain future of the woman who places her hope in Jesus. It will bring greater satisfaction and joy than the realization of any earthly hope. That is sweet.
Janet: Yes it is.
Jocelyn: That is helpful.
Stephanie: Yes, it is.
Janet: And that's a confident hope.
Stephanie: Yes, it is.
Janet: Nothing can take that away.
Stephanie: Miscarriage is common. God's people have been dealing with this kind of loss for a long time. After the initial loss is over, fear often takes the place of grief. By God's grace, we don't have to be controlled by fear. We don't know whether we can get pregnant again. But we do know the God who holds those decisions in his hands. We don't know whether or not we will have to walk this path again, but we do know the one who travels with us even through the valleys of the shadow of death. We have an amazing savior who holds the world in his hands. Isn't that encouraging?
Jocelyn: So encouraging.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: In addition to addressing fear, now there's a number of passages that encouraged me through my journey, and even in the days after. Maybe it will help our listeners to hear about some of them. So I'd like to transition now and talk about a few of those. I recognize that a lot of what we've talked about in both these episodes up to this point has been really, really hard. So I'd like to spend the remainder of our time talking about the hope we can have in the midst of hard because of Jesus. One of the things that I'd really like to start with is I know that the hope that we're gonna be talking about, not everybody has. So one of the reasons the Lord allows us to experience loss and hardships is so that we're not lulled into the belief that everything is okay. Let's imagine for a moment that we all grew up in homes where everything was always pleasant and worked out just the way we wanted them to. We got married through like a Hallmark movie. We had the exact number of children exactly when we wanted them, who never disobeyed got sick or created confusion. Wouldn't that be amazing? But you know what? We would convince ourselves that everything is okay if that's the type of environment we grew up in.
Janet: Who needs a savior?
Stephanie: And there isn't one. Yeah.
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Stephanie: Who needs Jesus? The world's all good. But we know that's not reality. That's not how life is. Miscarriage screams death at the top of its lungs.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: And it reminds us that not everything is okay. We live in a sin cursed world where death and disease are part of our normal experience. It is in this desperate thinking about our own brokenness that we see the beauty of the gospel. We were all born sinners, separated from God, and there's nothing we can do in and of ourselves to fix that. As the result of the curse of sin, death is inevitable, whether it's a baby in the womb, a teenager, a middle-aged woman, or a man in his eighties, Psalm 139 reminds us that everyone's days here on earth have been numbered. But it doesn't have to end there. I'm thankful for God's willingness to send his only son, Jesus, who was a perfect sacrifice for all mankind, for you and for me. Jesus willingly died a cruel death on a cross. He was buried for three days and then he rose from the grave. Why did he do that? Because he loves you and me, and apart from Jesus, we have no hope. 1 John 1:9 says that if we confess our sins, he's faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. It is by grace that you have been saved through faith. Not anything of your own doing, but it's the gift of God, not a result of work so that no man may boast. So for those of us who have a relationship with Jesus, not only do we have hope for the future, but we also have hope for the present. This God who has the power to save is alive today, and he is the one who is near the brokenhearted. He is the one who helps those whose spirits is crushed. Wow! There is no one better to be near your side than Jesus. If you don't have a relationship with God, let me encourage you to receive the free gift he has graciously given through his son right now, and then begin enjoying the hope that comes as a result of a relationship with him.
Janet: I think it can be easy for us to make the assumption that people know that hope.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Janet: And what we would never wanna do is be sharing all of this with someone who doesn't have access to that hope yet.
Stephanie: Yes.
Janet: But there is hope for them. That that could change today.
Stephanie: Yes.
Jocelyn: And you know, miscarriage, it is a big problem. But it's not the biggest problem.
Stephanie: Nope.
Jocelyn: And sometimes God allows big problems to help us deal with our biggest problems.
Stephanie: Absolutely.
Jocelyn: I'm so glad you were able to talk about how our hope is rooted in a relationship with God through Christ.
Janet: Right.
Stephanie: So let's talk about some of the hopeful passages. One of the passages that I clung to as I was striving to move forward after my miscarriage is found in Psalm 103. It was a balm to my soul. This Psalm reminds us of the Lord's mercy, and I'm just gonna read a few of the parts. The Lord pardons all your iniquities. He redeems your life from the pit. The Lord is compassionate and gracious. He is slow to anger in abounds and lovingkindness. He has not dealt with us according to our sins, nor rewarded us according to our iniquities. For as high as the heavens are above the earth. So great is his lovingkindness towards those who fear him. I implore you to read the entire chapter. And as you do, take note of the characteristics of God mentioned. I said a few, but there are many, many more. This is the God you can trust in your trouble, and that should give you a great hope.
Janet: I love that. That is a sweet Psalm. And just even the fact that he says he has compassion on us.
Stephanie: Yes.
Janet: So in those moments when. I'm not thinking the way I ought, I'm not trusting God. His response is compassion.
Stephanie: Yes.
Janet: So I can run.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Jocelyn: And he's full of lovingkindness. I think when difficult things happen sometimes our temptation is to think that God is mean. And I think that Psalm is helpful to remember his actual character. He's a good God full of overflowing love.
Janet: Yeah.
Jocelyn: Not all the things that we're tempted to sometimes think about God
Stephanie: Sure.
Jocelyn: When something that we really want gets taken from us.
Janet: Yeah.
Stephanie: I recently heard a teaching on Deuteronomy four. I don't know if you guys are familiar with Deuteronomy four..
Jocelyn: I love Deuteronomy four.
Stephanie: I've read it several times, but the teaching that I heard was focused on the ways God's character was displayed in this particular passage. We were challenged to think, if we believe God is 'blank' and you fill in the blank with the description of God, then how should that impact your relationship with him? There are several in this text, so I'm not going to cover them all, but I want to give you a taste of the hope we can have simply because of who God is. I would encourage you to read and study the passage and meditate on how each of the descriptions of God should impact your own relationship with him. As you do, I hope you're able to view the troubles, the heartaches and the disappointments in your own life through this lens. The God who is described in Deuteronomy four is the same God we serve today. He hasn't changed and he continues to be faithful and trustworthy. Verses 1 and 13 talk about God being the giver of good and gracious gifts. If I believe God is the giver of good and gracious gifts, I can talk to him about all things. I can go to him with my request knowing that he is the giver of good gifts. Let's think about this verse or two verses through the lens of miscarriage. I think we would all agree that humanly speaking, miscarriage is something that no one wants to sign up for.
Janet: That’s right.
Stephanie: And humanly speaking, it's not good.
Janet: Right.
Stephanie: What is good about it?
Janet: It’s death.
Stephanie: It is. It's death. But knowing that God is the giver of good gifts, when I get something I didn't want, I can and should embrace it. Great reminder.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: And it doesn't even have to be with just miscarriage. It can be anything I don't get.
Jocelyn: There are so many ways that applies to life.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Janet: Right.
Stephanie: Verse seven talks about God being near. If I believe God is near, it frees me up to focus on other things and to embrace the purpose God has for me. I don't have to be consumed by fear because God is right here with me. Verse 20 talks about God being the deliverer. If I believe God is the deliverer, I don't have to be discouraged because the trial is not bigger than God. Verses 35 and 39 talk about God being the only true God. If I believe God is the only true God, then I will intentionally worship the Lord and guard my heart against anything else that might capture it.
Jocelyn: I love the part about God being my deliverer and God being near, because sometimes I would imagine miscarriage feeling very isolating.
Janet: Right.
Jocelyn: Because no one else knows what you're going through or what it feels like. And I love that you can focus on God's nearness and cry out in the middle of that for deliverance.
Stephanie: Yes.
Jocelyn: Deliverance from the really terrible feelings that are occupying a lot of your hours. As you're recovering from a, you know, that's a big medical procedure sometimes after a miscarriage.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Janet: You've earlier on in the podcast talked about the fact that we need to take our thoughts captive. Now you've just given us a way to do that. Like what do I do when my mind's running everywhere? I can go to this passage and I can start writing. I don't feel like it. I get it. But you can still choose to do that and be taking your thoughts captive to something better and far more hopeful. I love that.
Stephanie: Romans eight is one of my favorite passages. There's a lot of stuff in Romans eight.
Janet: Oh, yes.
Stephanie: We're just going to list a few things here, but I'm sure you could list several more things. Verse 26 and 27, the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. Very encouraging. I think everybody probably knows verses 28 and 29. But if you really think about them, we can have hope because God has promised to work all things together for good to those who love him. Now, some of you may be asking, how in the world is a miscarriage good?
Janet: Right.
Stephanie: And we've already said there isn't anything good about it. And you're right, there isn't. Those who have experienced miscarriage are part of a club they never would've signed up for if given the option. It's hard and it's painful on many levels. So when we think about something that is good, we tend to think about things we like, things which bring us pleasure. Or maybe we associate good with getting what we want or what we think is best for us, which we've already mentioned today on this podcast. We need to keep reading though, because verse 29 tells us how God defines good. Good means that God is conforming us to the image of his son, Jesus. He's using the hard days, the pain and the suffering to make us more like Christ. So based on God's definition of good, we can believe that if something is good for us, God will give it to us. This may be a new way of thinking for some of you, but let me encourage you to train yourself to think correctly about the things God allows in your life. He is good, he is trustworthy, and he isn't going to waste the pain we are enduring.
Jocelyn: if God is using something as really horrible as miscarriage to build us into the character of Christ, that is good. And I think in the middle of really, tragic suffering, it's hard to remember that me being conformed to Christ is a good thing.
Stephanie: Yep.
Jocelyn: Even if it means walking through this really difficult path. I'm so glad you shared that with us.
Janet: Yeah.
Stephanie: Verses 31 and 32 remind us that God has already given us everything we need. Our greatest need has been provided for through the sacrificial death of Christ on the cross. Nothing temporal will ever be able to meet that need. So we can be satisfied and joyous in a close relationship with Jesus. And then 35 through 39 reminds us that nothing can separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus. Romans eight emphasizes the security we can have in Jesus. But it's still possible to view ourselves as the only ones who have ever suffered in certain ways. It is still tempting to say that I am the only one. So that thinking leads us right into Hebrews 4:15 and 16, which says, for we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin. Therefore, let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need. This passage outlines three truths that are exceedingly powerful as we seek God's comfort in the midst of our suffering. The first thing is Jesus understands. Notice the words tempted in all things. Jesus endured challenges that have remarkable similarities to all of the ones we endure. We can see the depth of his suffering over the loss of his relationship with his father, when he cried out from the cross, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? It is this suffering that puts Jesus in the best possible position to understand all that you are experiencing.
Jocelyn: That's such a comfort.
Janet: It is. I love at the end of Hebrews two, he tells us that one of the reasons that Jesus became a man, Was so that he could relate to us in our suffering.
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: That's amazing. I mean, we all suffer.
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: But I don't know any of us that would say, I'm gonna go choose it.
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: So I can understand you a little better.
Jocelyn: So I can relate to you. Yeah.
Stephanie: Yep.
Janet: You know? But to think that's his heart, and because of that, the throne that in the Old Testament, you approach with fear and trembling once a year, and you better deal with your own sin first. And there was all of those boundaries, rightly so, because of God's Holiness. Because of Christ it is now a throne of grace. We run boldly to it.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Janet: That's crazy.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Janet: How can I not trust Jesus?
Stephanie: Yep.
Janet: With that?
Stephanie: The second truth from this passage is draw near to Jesus. It is not God's desire for you to live in a world of silence where you suffer alone. Instead, go to Jesus. Pour out your heart to him. He cares and is always with you. And you know, I think this is really important because we all know that in the midst of suffering, there's a lot of people around. If we choose that. If we choose to communicate our suffering.
Janet: Right.
Stephanie: But after a little bit of time, everybody goes back to their normal lives.
Janet: And yours is not.
Stephanie: And yours is not. So when your husband and children leave for the day, Jesus is the one who's still there with you. When you wake up in the middle of the night in tears, Jesus is there. And we all know those moments when you know we're just driving in our car and all of a sudden a thought comes in our mind and we just lose it.
Janet: Yes.
Stepanie: Sometimes you just lose it.
Janet: Yep.
Stephanie: That's okay, because Jesus is still there with us. So friend, there is no one else Like Jesus. Take hope in the fact that he is a friend who completely understands and who will never leave us or forsake us. So draw near to him. The third truth is that Jesus provides everything we need. Because Jesus has experienced all the temptations that come with suffering and yet was perfectly obedient, not only can he sympathize with our weaknesses, But he also offers up his help to overcome the challenges we are experiencing. As you draw near to Jesus, you will find grace and mercy to help in your time of need.
Jocelyn: That's such a helpful passage because I can imagine how strong it might feel to need another baby. Or to need a baby that is born full term. it's comforting to know that Jesus knows our real needs.
Stephanie: Yep.
Jocelyn: And we can talk to him about what we want. But he will give us what we need.
Stephanie: Yeah. We've talked a little bit about Psalm 139 that was in the first podcast. And I wanna encourage you just to take the time to go back and to read the entire passage and take note of a few things. Take note of God's knowledge. Take note of his presence. And take note of his power. And let the God who loves you so intimately lead you in the days ahead. 2 Corinthians 12:9 and 10 says that we can remember that God's grace is sufficient for us. God's gonna strengthen us for whatever he calls us to be in that moment.
Jocelyn: That's been a really, he helpful passage for me in other times of fear in my life, like especially like the what if moments, what if this happens? Well, God hasn't given me the grace that I needed to handle that because it's not happening right now.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Jocelyn: I really appreciate knowing that in the exact minute that I need his help, he promises his grace. And so you can walk forward in that active, trusting pattern. Like, I trust you and I'm cultivating faithfulness.
Stephanie: Yes.
Jocelyn: I trust you and I'm being responsible because you'll give me what I need in the moment.
Stephanie: Yeah.
Janet: Right.
Stephanie: Do you guys have any passages that are encouraging to you?
Jocelyn: I actually am thinking of our memory verse passage, trust in the Lord and do good. I am so, so thankful that that verse was what was chosen for us to memorize because I have had to counsel myself with it so many times. Like, what do I do right now? Trust in the Lord. And what do I do now? Do good. What do I do now? Cultivate faithfulness. So I can pour out my request to the Lord. In this situation, like I would love to have another baby, I would love to have a pregnancy that comes full term. And what do I do while I'm pouring my heart out to the Lord? I trust him.
Janet: Yeah.
Jocelyn: I do good. I dwell in the land. I cultivate faithfulness. I commit my way to the Lord. I delight myself in him and he gives me the desires of my heart. What are the desires of my heart? Him. I also have things that I would like, like a baby. But I'm pouring out my heart to him and committing my ways to him. And then like I'm resting in him, I'm waiting patiently for him. I've just been soaking in that passage for the last months as we've memorized it and just found so much motivation for doing the right thing.
Janet: Right. Yeah. I love Psalm 34 as well. I will bless the Lord at all times, not just
Jocelyn: Not when I'm happy.
Janet: Right. Yeah. His praise will always be on my lips. I will boast in the Lord. The humble will hear and be glad. Proclaim the Lord's greatness with me. Let us exalt his name together. But I love that He, it's kind of like a, we should be asking at that point, why. Why would you do that? And then he goes on, I sought the Lord and he answered me and rescued me from all my fears.
Jocelyn: I love that passage.
Janet: Those who look to him are radiant with joy. Their faces will never be ashamed. What am I like? This poor man cried and the Lord heard him. So I love, you know, goes on taste and see that the Lord is good. But Psalm 34 I think is a really sweet psalm reminding me that I run to the Lord and how he responds.
Jocelyn: Yeah. I've been meditating on Psalm 28:7, which I think also applies to this topic. It says, the Lord is my strength and my shield. Not getting what I want, not being relieved of my suffering. The Lord is my strength and my shield. My heart trusts in him, and I am helped. So it's not, I got what I wanted. The Lord took away this thing I didn't want. What my heart trusts in is that he Will help me.
Janet: Yeah.
Jocelyn: Therefore, my heart triumphs. And with my song, I shall thank him. And it's cool because in this passage, there's no alteration of the circumstances. The circumstances are what pushed me to Jesus.
Janet: Yeah.
Jocelyn: But he is my comfort. He's my help, he's my trust. And because of that, I can have a triumphant heart. Not because anything different has happened.
Janet: Yeah.
Stephanie: Well, thanks for sharing. There are so many passages in God's word.
Jocelyn: Yeah.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: That can bring hope and encouragement in these situations. And maybe we discussed one of yours, maybe we didn't. But if you have a favorite of your own, keep meditating on it. And I would encourage you, write it on a three by five card. Post it wherever you need to be reminded of who God is and how that can impact your relationship with Christ.
Janet: Yes.
Stephanie: I wanna end with this quote by Elizabeth Elliot. The secret of joy is Christ in me, not me in a different set of circumstances.
Jocelyn: I love that.
Stephanie: Yes, it's very convicting. Friends, our joy and our satisfaction can only be found in Jesus. I encourage you to embrace whatever season you are in right now, knowing that your loving and gracious heavenly Father is in control of every detail of your life, and he can be trusted. Because of Christ you can have hope and joy, both for today as well as for the days ahead.
Janet: I love that. Thank you, Steph. And I think realizing even if they're in the middle of that season, they don't have to remain enslaved to those idols.
Stephanie: Yes.
Janet: In the midst of that season, they can be deepening their trust in the Lord.
Stephanie: Absolutely.
Janet: Experiencing sweet fellowship as they grieve.
Stephanie: Yep.
Janet: Because there are things to grieve as well.
Jocelyn: Because of his nearness to us.
Janet: Yeah. That's beautiful. Well, we, last episode talked about several resources. So you can go back and listen to it there, or it's gonna be in the show notes, the episode description, the transcript for both episodes. So all of those are available. And I hope that if that will be helpful to you, that you'll take the time to go seek them out. But thank you, Stephanie, for coming. This has been really helpful.
Stephanie: You’re welcome.
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